Got thumped

[newarcher]

We placed 13 out of 71 cars in the district races on Saturday.

The winner was a credit card with wheels that was so thin I would be afraid that a rough stop would break it. It had a spare wheel looking thing about an inch in front of the back wheels on top.

We ran a 3.80. 3.81, and 3.81.

The winning car ran a 3.645, which literally smoked everything by factors.

I wonder what his secret was because I KNOW that a lot of the dads worked those alignments and axles/wheels well.

Anyway, the green streak is over. It was fun.

Thanks for all the help,
New

[gpraceman]

Being in the Top 20% at districts is not getting thumped

[PWD_addict]

We placed 13 out of 71 cars in the district races on Saturday.

The winner was a credit card with wheels that was so thin I would be afraid that a rough stop would break it. It had a spare wheel looking thing about an inch in front of the back wheels on top.

We ran a 3.80. 3.81, and 3.81.

The winning car ran a 3.645, which literally smoked everything by factors.

I wonder what his secret was because I KNOW that a lot of the dads worked those alignments and axles/wheels well.

Anyway, the green streak is over. It was fun.

Thanks for all the help,
New

Even making it to District is quite an accomplishment! You should be proud.
Wow--that's quite a difference in times. Any guess as to how close #2 was to the winning car?

[newarcher]

That same car set 3.69 and I think the next car closest was about 3.75.

When I say that car ran away with it, I mean it ran AWAY with it.

I heard some grumblings about ringer wheels and speed axles, but I didn't join in. I just said "well, whoever built it certainly did a lot of things right!". I didn't like the grumblings because there were scouts around and I didn't want anyone to hear their car degraded.

There was one kid I really felt sorry for because his rail car was rubbing and was exceptionally slow. The dad was up fussing at the organizers but there was nothing they could do. Clearly, he lowered the car so he had no basis for his complant.

Overall, we are pleased. The disappointment of the day turned into happiness at having done well. We just wanted to do better!

We learned a lot of lessons this year and will remember the missteps...like drilling the axle holes after we sanded the sides of the car and some others.

It gave us a chance to win and a chance to lose, can't ask for much more than that!

New

[Teeeman]

The rubbing car should not have passed inspection…

our rules say 3/8” min belly clearance between the wheels…

most tracks guidestrips are ½” or less…

Good call on not helping the grumblers!


We get smoked at District every year… 15th… 40th or so… 6th this year… but the top 2 cars are always fast enough that I spend the rest of the year doing things like clarifying rules and developing tougher inspections for them.

Still didn’t matter this year… but we made top 10 at least…

my son was VERY happy and so was I!

-Terry

[sporty]

My son placed 3rd at district at rockford. It was a long day ! 3rd place got a good size trophy.

Sporty




Edited face for child safety.

[blcrow33]

Now that is some third place trophy.
Congrats.

[newarcher]

Man alive that is a huge trophy! Our trophy for first place wasn't a fifth of that size!

Sad commentary on America that we have to white kid's faces out.

Congrats to your son.

Regarding the rules, I really would have liked to see them enforce them a lot. I have a hard time believing that a car could smoke like that and not have some illegal stuff on it. Perhaps but I searched the internet for every single advantage we could legally use and didn't run anywhere near that time. So either we did a bad job at alignment and wheel prep, that scout did a superior job (I can't see that unless he knows some really good secrets), or he bought some speed wheels and axles.

At district check in, they weighed the cars only to the tenths decimal point. They checked for length and width, and that was it. At the pack race, they checked those features plus they ensured no raised wheels, made sure the tread wasn't narrowed or removed, ensured that the entire surface of all four wheels touched the table, etc. Surprisingly, it was much tougher inspection at the pack.

The results were typical for what you would expect from the best of the best. An entire pack of cars at the top with time differences of only hundreds or even thousandths of a second between them....kind of like the Olympics where the difference between the first and tenth place finish being milliseconds. Then you have this car that beat everyone by several tenths of a second. It just kind of is questionable when I know several dads that pushed their kids to get weight, wheels, and alignment just right.

Anyway, no sour grapes and I am not accusing the lad of anything. If he was completely legal, I want to know what he did that we didn't.

New

[sporty]

My son is more or less a fluke car !


No 2 gram or 1 gram wheels. just the outer wheel shaved up for smoothness. Stock wheel base.

His last year there, and finally not only got to rockford but got 3rd.


as I hae suggested, just build plenty of cars, and have a track to test them. Each year save the fastest car, and the following year build and compare to the previous years fastest car that you and your child made.

The kids have fun helping build them also.

Sporty

[Teeeman]

Our track is 85% designed and 15% built already




I have little doubt if one were to use scientific analysis and dissect a “fluke” through a series of testing and measurements that would make NASA blush with shame… you would know WHY it worked…

but when (like us) you have limited abilities to build and (hopefully) possess a decent (but probably not perfect) understanding of what will make the best car for the tracks you plan to run…

there is some truth that you use the same recipe and techniques on multiple cars and just by luck everything lines up closer to perfect for a particular car and it is the hotrod

If we had perfect quality/process control in our garages and if we have the science perfect, you could build 1000 cars and they would all run the same…

if I have learned anything this year it is just how important alignment truly is… and we are FAR from mastering it…

We too built extra cars… 4 to be exact… and there were minor design differences… but the one that should have been fastest was not… the one that should have been the middle of the group (on paper) was the fastest.

Science is nice… but…

“fluke” is much easier to deal with as a good explanation

Besides, is it not scientific if you know you are still working with some random variances that the laws of probability do support producing a “fluke” eventually if you build enough cars? Thus it is not voodoo or guesswork to build multiples in that sense but good science?

Statistics say you have a better chance if you use this approach I think…

(of course as we know, statistics don’t lie… but liars know statistics, hahahahah!)




On a much more serious note:
Congrats to your son and to you for guiding and supporting him Sporty!!!!!


-Terry

[sporty]

Thanks Teeman,

I would agree, that with science and good match and formulas, its not so much as a fluke.

I feel that the tungsten played a role in it. it was the 1st year we used it. Also I think we got the weight pretty darn close.

Without cnc machine, to drill the wholes for weight, in the same place everytime or a router with some nice templates. Then its more by luck.

I have tried several math formulas found here and on other sites. Built over 30 cars the past 5 years. Using those formulas.

This year I went with my own. One that was not typically seen or read about. And it was faster. This is in regards to weight placement only.

I only came with mine, from testing on tracks and keep track of where the weight has been placed and tried or repeated on the other cars.

I have gone with 1/4 ounce car body to 1 oz car body.

I think we all are better in some areas than others. When my youngest gets into cub scouts. I would hope we can improve and atleast repeat what was done this year, in regards to car speed.

I saw very few long axle cars wins. So i think it's not always a sure thing to go with the longer axle spacing.

I think it has to be done right, to beat out a good stock axle placement car.

I use hodges graphite and I smash it up even finer, like to a powder. I use a small painters brush and apply it.

There was alot of cars there, that were not even close to being aero dynamic. But they were fast.

the two cars, that beat my son, one had a cheater bar, made out of plastic and steel wire. Not for sure if it was legal.

here is a pic of the cars-

[Go Bubba Go]

My son is more or less a fluke car!

No 2 gram or 1 gram wheels. just the outer wheel shaved up for smoothness. Stock wheel base.

His last year there, and finally not only got to rockford but got 3rd.

as I have suggested, just build plenty of cars, and have a track to test them. Each year save the fastest car, and the following year build and compare to the previous years fastest car that you and your child made.

The kids have fun helping build them also.

Sporty

I had a chance to meet Sporty this year at Rockford, and I will say that after an up close and personal look at his son's car (as well as the other finalists) he can call it a "fluke" if he wants, but the car showed a lot of craftsmanship and effort. He and his boy should both be very proud.

One interesting thing I discovered about Sporty at Rockford was that he and I both have younger ones "in the wings". If neither of us gets too tired or moves too far away, I look forward to an "annual meeting" with the Sporty clan at the Council races. Kind of fun to put a face with a Nickname.

Now I just have to get him to volunteer to run one of the tracks for us Lot more work than I thought at first. Not used to standing for hours at a time...

[PWD]

Sporty, congrats to you and your son. That is an unbelivable 3rd place trophy. It is a lot bigger than most 1st place trophies.

[Go Bubba Go]

Sporty, congrats to you and your son. That is an unbelivable 3rd place trophy. It is a lot bigger than most 1st place trophies.

Agreed, they are very nice.

To put it in context, I heard back from our Council Chairman that there were 140 Packs and just under 1200 boys that participated in the event in which Sporty's boy made it to the finals. Assuming even distribution between the 10 categories (1st Grade Winner and Runner Up, 2nd Grade Winner and Runner up, etc.), 3rd place out of 120 boys (in his case 120 5th Grade winners at the Pack level) is pretty impressive.

They are pretty substantial trophies, even considering the number of boys involved. One of our local Jaycees organizations co-sponsors the event and covers the cost of the trophies and plaques for design.

[sporty]

Thank you everyone for the kind words.


I do wonder what your thought are on the middle car in the picture, in regards to the cheater bar ?


Sporty