Grand Prix Software - initial use

[jbofkc]

Folks,

Any tips on my first use of the Grand Prix software we recently purchased? What to expect? Suggested uses to get familiar with the software? ETC. I have about 7 weeks to play with it - if you will put it through its paces.

A few dads and I on the PWD committee are going to race our old cars from our childhood for fun and set up a race to run the software.

Due to excellent fundraising efforts, our pack also purchased a new 6-lane Best Track and a new timing system. Previously, we had a 4-lane track with about 60-70 boys entered in the pack race.

Any suggested race formats using this software? I understand there are a few to select from. Pervious years we used a points system primarily limited to interphase with computer, timer system and that the software was created by a parent - he did a great job - but I expect the Grand Prix software to be an upgrade.

Thanks.

[gpraceman]

Any tips on my first use of the Grand Prix software we recently purchased.

Yep. Make sure to read the Quick Start Tutorial and don't wait until the last minute to get acquainted with it.

[Pinewood Daddy]

I ran it for the first time, but our Pack had used it about 4 years ago.

Setup the racers in their groups ahead of time. You can delete anyone who doesn't come before racing.

Don't forget to test it with your electronics ahead of time!!

My biggest problem is after we deleted a couple of kids who didn't make it, it wouldn't run. I finally figured out I had to rerun the schedule! It worked great after that!!

We use Lane Rotation. Winners are determined by highest average time.

[gpraceman]

You can delete anyone who doesn't come before racing.

There's no need to delete no shows. You can simply not check them off as being passed through inspection. Only racers checked as being passed will be added to the schedule.

Don't forget to test it with your electronics ahead of time!!

I second and third that! If there is a communication problem, it can take some time to find the source (timer, cable, USB adapter, software).

My biggest problem is after we deleted a couple of kids who didn't make it, it wouldn't run. I finally figured out I had to rerun the schedule! It worked great after that!!

The latest version is better at letting you know that a schedule needs to be regenerated whenever you make a roster change.

We use Lane Rotation. Winners are determined by highest average time.

Personally, I recommend the Perfect-N type charts. With Lane Rotation, racers race against mostly the same racers over and over. That is rather boring and gets discouraging for the ones always getting beat. Perfect-N type charts give each racer a variety of opponents, so a racer stands a better chance of doing well in a heat. Granted, if scoring by times, then finish order doesn't matter, but people still want to place high in a heat.

[Stan Pope]

Personally, I recommend the Perfect-N type charts. With Lane Rotation, racers race against mostly the same racers over and over. That is rather boring and gets discouraging for the ones always getting beat. Perfect-N type charts give each racer a variety of opponents, so a racer stands a better chance of doing well in a heat. Granted, if scoring by times, then finish order doesn't matter, but people still want to place high in a heat.

Another value of the more diversified match-ups is that, after the racing is done, you can get a good measure of your track and electronics stability (consistency through the racing period) by correlating results from time scoring and points scoring. Granted, that is not the best time to discover that you have a problem, but it can reassure you.

[Pinewood Daddy]

You can delete anyone who doesn't come before racing.

There's no need to delete no shows. You can simply not check them off as being passed through inspection. Only racers checked as being passed will be added to the schedule.

Great!! I should have figured that out!:roll:

We use Lane Rotation. Winners are determined by highest average time.

Personally, I recommend the Perfect-N type charts. With Lane Rotation, racers race against mostly the same racers over and over. That is rather boring and gets discouraging for the ones always getting beat. Perfect-N type charts give each racer a variety of opponents, so a racer stands a better chance of doing well in a heat. Granted, if scoring by times, then finish order doesn't matter, but people still want to place high in a heat.

Perfect-N was tried 4 years ago and it confused everyone. They didn't understand why their son's car ran 1 race and disappeared.

I agree, they shouldn't have to race the same cars. Especially the one who race my 2 son's cars!

[jbofkc]

Is Perfect N time or points based? We have never had the capabilities to run a time race, but we will now. Advantages of either?

[gpraceman]

Perfect-N was tried 4 years ago and it confused everyone. They didn't understand why their son's car ran 1 race and disappeared.

I just explain to everyone up front that the schedule will mix up which heats each racer will be in, but by the time the last heat has been run they will have run in each lane of the track. It may also help to print out the schedule and post it on a wall so everyone can see which particular heats they are in.

[Stan Pope]

Is Perfect N time or points based? We have never had the capabilities to run a time race, but we will now. Advantages of either?

PPN scheduling (the general form of Perfect-N) works well for both "points final standing" competition and "cummulative time" racing. It was originally developed to improve accuracy in points racing.

The key to these successful uses is the list of criteria that PPN charts satisfy. Criteria are listed at http://members.aol.com/standcmr/ppngen.html. PPN arose because true Perfect-N charts only exist for a few Lanes-Cars-Rounds combinations.

[gpraceman]

Is Perfect N time or points based? We have never had the capabilities to run a time race, but we will now. Advantages of either?

You can use either one. Each has its pros and cons. Personally, I'd go by times as long as you are confident that your start gate will open consistently (type of gate that is spring loaded to open with the release of a lever or catch vs one that depends entirely on a human to open).

[Pinewood Daddy]

Perfect-N was tried 4 years ago and it confused everyone. They didn't understand why their son's car ran 1 race and disappeared.

I just explain to everyone up front that the schedule will mix up which heats each racer will be in, but by the time the last heat has been run they will have run in each lane of the track. It may also help to print out the schedule and post it on a wall so everyone can see which particular heats they are in.

We have food available at our event so each Den is called down when their cars are to run. It's hard to keep the kids (and many parents!) attention for almost 2 hours.

This year we only have 25 kids and probably only 22 will race. That's only 88 runs, at 45 seconds per run, or only a little over an hour. Then we run the Open class. Maybe I can convince the Committee to run the Perfect-N this year, giving them the point my boys won't be "killing" the same cars every race! I could make a poster with the schedule on it. If we have a projector again the software shows the "on deck" racers, so there is some advance warning of when the cars are running.

Food for though (pardon the pun).

[gpraceman]

We have food available at our event so each Den is called down when their cars are to run. It's hard to keep the kids (and many parents!) attention for almost 2 hours.

This year we only have 25 kids and probably only 22 will race. That's only 88 runs, at 45 seconds per run, or only a little over an hour. Then we run the Open class. Maybe I can convince the Committee to run the Perfect-N this year, giving them the point my boys won't be "killing" the same cars every race! I could make a poster with the schedule on it. If we have a projector again the software shows the "on deck" racers, so there is some advance warning of when the cars are running.

We have about 60 scouts and we just run one race group, with subgroups defined for each rank. This way we only have the one schedule to manage and no one is waiting for their group's turn to race. We break halfway through for lunch. After racing is done, the software gives us the standings for each of the subgroups. With this setup, you will have Tigers racing Webelos, but if you are scoring by time it really doesn't matter who a racer runs against. We find it keeps everyone more involved and is easier for the race crew to manage.

[Pinewood Daddy]

We have about 60 scouts and we just run one race group, with subgroups defined for each rank. This way we only have the one schedule to manage and no one is waiting for their group's turn to race. We break halfway through for lunch. After racing is done, the software gives us the standings for each of the subgroups. With this setup, you will have Tigers racing Webelos, but if you are scoring by time it really doesn't matter who a racer runs against. We find it keeps everyone more involved and is easier for the race crew to manage.

I like that idea, but some people may not like the idea of their Tiger running against a experienced Webelo.

We've got such a small Pack, running as one large group, with subgroups for standings, makes sense.

[Stan Pope]

I like that idea, but some people may not like the idea of their Tiger running against a experienced Webelo.

With times, "racing in a heat against" and "competing against" are different. Note that if you run one round on a 4-lane track, each racer will have a total of 12 opponents. PPN will scatter those equitably against the entire pool of competitors.

If you can display the entire chart at once (e. g. printed and hung on a wall), then folks can see WHEN they race and can see WHO they race against. If WHO they race is important (as it is with points racing), then you should arrange for random mapping of racers into the chart. I do this by having the boys draw for race numbers when tell where they fit in the chart. It could also be done through open-source software. Random mapping negates any thoughts of manipulation.

[Pinewood Daddy]

If you can display the entire chart at once (e. g. printed and hung on a wall), then folks can see WHEN they race and can see WHO they race against. If WHO they race is important (as it is with points racing), then you should arrange for random mapping of racers into the chart. I do this by having the boys draw for race numbers when tell where they fit in the chart. It could also be done through open-source software. Random mapping negates any thoughts of manipulation.

How does that work if a couple of kids don't race?? It always seems to happen. Then you have to rerun the chart. That eliminates the possibility of printing a huge chart for the wall.