2nd Fastest Car in Louisville

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pgosselin
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2nd Fastest Car in Louisville

Post by pgosselin »

Another good day for the Gosselin team. Today was the Metro Louisville Pinewood Derby. (Last year our council eliminated the District races and replaced them with three regional races.) My son, Jon, a 4th Grade Webelo, bested all but one car out of 243 to take second place in the Louisville region. This was our most impressive win to date. Again, a big round of thanks to everyone on Derby Talk who has given us advice over the last year. As you can see, it really helped. Pics and vids if you follow the link.

Paul

http://s1134.photobucket.com/albums/m61 ... d%20Derby/" target="_blank
Speedster
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Re: 2nd Fastest Car in Louisville

Post by Speedster »

CONGRATULATIONS on the win. That is quite an accomplishment.
I'm also impressed with the photography.

I'm curious about how many tracks were used and what type scoring system was used.
pgosselin
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Re: 2nd Fastest Car in Louisville

Post by pgosselin »

Speedster wrote:CONGRATULATIONS on the win. That is quite an accomplishment.
I'm also impressed with the photography.

I'm curious about how many tracks were used and what type scoring system was used.

Thanks, Speedster.

The photography and movies were all taken with my iphone. I'm less impressed with the photography, but more astounded by the movies. They convert easily to HD and look awesome. I can't believe they were recorded with a phone.

As for your questions about how it was run, it had two identical 38' wooden tracks with four lanes each. They would take 16 kids at a time (regardless of rank) and run them against each other one one track. While that race was running, they would be assembling the next 16 at the other track. Once they had 16, they would start racing on it.

They were using a double elimination scoring system. They would have kids select index cards for random lane assignments. They would run four cars, identify the winner, then separate him from the other three. They would then send the other three back to race again after the other three groups of four raced. At this point, you would have 4 winners separated from the others. The others would then draw cards again for random lane assignments and to select competitors. They would then race in four groups of three. Four more winners would be selected and separated out. The losers would be handed a patch at the end of their race, told congratulations, and dismissed. So you are down to eight, now. They would then race these eight in a similar fashion, until they had double eliminated everyone except four. These four would be told to come back at 1 p.m. to compete in the final rounds. Oh, by the way, each kid was given a name card which was pinned to their shirt. Every time they won a race, they got a blue star. If they had lost a race, but came back and won the next one, they got a red star.

I counted approximately 49 cars on the table for the big round of races at 1 p.m. They divided the boys as evenly as they could between the two tracks and raced them in a similar fashion to the morning. Once they were down to around 12 boys on each side, they combined them all on one track to battle it out for the six trophies. Double elimination again to determine winners and rankings.

Over the course of the day, my son lost three races, but managed to battle back in the next race to keep advancing. Obviously, that came to a halt during the final race.

All in all, it was run very efficiently. Surprisingly efficient for being as low tech as it was. They had Fast Track electronic scoring sensors at the base of the track to identify order of finish, but they did not display track times. Not a bad experience at all for us, but then again, we kept winning. The kids who got eliminated early during the morning only got to run two races before they were shown the door. Kinda brutal for them, I would think.

My Pack uses the Raceview software and an electronic scoring system so this was my first experience with double elimination. Our system allows every scout to run a minimum of four times. I like our system better, but did not have a bad experience at all with the double elimination system. The double elimination process probably allowed them to move more scouts through the event. Plus, walk-ins were allowed. So since they had no idea of who and how many kids were coming, they couldn't really use a software solution.

Paul
rpcarpe
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Re: 2nd Fastest Car in Louisville

Post by rpcarpe »

Congrats!
Sounds like lots of racing, and it keeps the kids involved
My wife started a new support group... Widows of the Pinewood Derby.
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Stan Pope
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Re: 2nd Fastest Car in Louisville

Post by Stan Pope »

Three roses and a raspberry!

First rose is for Jon for the good showing!

Second rose if for the Louisville group for the short time between when the boy finishes inspection until when he races.

Third rose if for the Louisville group for having the owner/drivers stage their own cars. The boys were participants, not spectators!

The raspberry is for the Louisville group for sending half the boys home after 2 heats and another quarter of the boys home after 4 heats. Not all of the cars were built to win, but they were all definitely built to race... and race they should! At this age the racing (participating) is more important than the winning.
Stan
"If it's not for the boys, it's for the birds!"
pgosselin
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Re: 2nd Fastest Car in Louisville

Post by pgosselin »

Well said, Stan. When you witness boys being eliminated that quickly, you realize how a system like your new one would make the experience more enjoyable for the boys. On the other hand, it would have extended the event quite a ways in time. Guess there are trade-offs everywhere.

Paul
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Stan Pope
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Re: 2nd Fastest Car in Louisville

Post by Stan Pope »

pgosselin wrote:Well said, Stan. When you witness boys being eliminated that quickly, you realize how a system like your new one would make the experience more enjoyable for the boys. On the other hand, it would have extended the event quite a ways in time. Guess there are trade-offs everywhere.

Paul
With your registrant count (about 200), you could do our variant of the 15th Burlington by age group
in less than 8 hours start to finish, and every Scout gets at least 15 heats and spends about 1 hour 15 minutes racing. On that schedule you would have room to increase participation next year to (easily) 250 to 300.

The downside is the average time between completing inspection and starting racing. I think we opened inspection for each age group when the prior group started racing. So, time from finish inspection until start racing is about 1 hour 30 minutes... average 45 minutes.
Stan
"If it's not for the boys, it's for the birds!"
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Re: 2nd Fastest Car in Louisville

Post by J.Stein »

As far as the issue of boys going home after two or three races (losses) that happened to my son our first year at the Louisville race (2011) at the Carpenter's Hall and he didn't seem to mind. The "fun day" was at the Pack races which we'd already had where the boys got to race each other for as long as they were interested after the official racing was over. The District indeed needed to "move this along" with so many kids in attendance.

This time my son (like the OP's son) got to come back after lunch and he made it to the final 12. oh so close! We had a great time.

I only had two criticisms of the race and I hope the District considers them. I'll share them with you since your a honcho now. ;) Maybe they'll consider your opinion.

1. The published Rules needed to say that the measurement of the wheels must be no less than 1.180. Even we had to head into the dining area and replace a wheel that the guy with the caliper said was under 1.180. He said he was enforcing the "no lathing" rule. No...he was enforcing an undisclosed rule. Just go ahead and put the specifics in the published rules. Everyone who was remotely competitive polished and trued their wheels. State the 1.180 rule in the rules so we'll all be on the exact same page. I bought a Go /No Go gauge after the race so we had better not run into caliper issues next year.

2. The old wooden tracks used were junk. Seriously they were a decade past their prime. They were worse than the one our Pack gave away last year. I don't know why they were chosen over aluminum tracks (they used some aluminum tracks in 2011 so they must have been available). We were part of the first group to race and my son's car was on the outside lane. It hit the folded foam barrier at the end and jumped off the track and bounced across the cement. Later, I noted that some cars were actually binding on the third lane of the far track.
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