Excluding Tigers from competing for Pack Champion?

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Nitro Dan
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Excluding Tigers from competing for Pack Champion?

Post by Nitro Dan »

We had our Derby this past weekend and upon reviewing everything a suggestion was made that next year we exclude the Tigers from competing for the Pack Champion as there may be "to much dad" in their cars. None of the Tigers were Pack Champions this year, so I'm not sure what sparked this as an idea. I haven't heard of anyone doing this before and I'm not to keen on the idea. I would like to know if anyone has ever excluded the youngest group from your races, and how receptive was it with your organization?

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Stan Pope
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Re: Excluding Tigers from competing for Pack Champion?

Post by Stan Pope »

[with tongue pushed firmly in my cheek...]
The following year, they should exclude Wolf Scouts on the same basis ... Their dads, on average, are much more involved than the Webelos Dads! And then the Bears, and then the first year Webelos. But, then you have only the yougsters who raced in the Webelos 2 races. Why race 'em again? No need for any finals at all!
[Withdraws tongue ...]
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gpraceman
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Re: Excluding Tigers from competing for Pack Champion?

Post by gpraceman »

I'm with Stan on this.

From the very first Pinewood Derby race, this is intended to be a "team" activity of an adult working with a child where the child does what they are capable of doing. Unfortunately, we only recognize the kids when handing out the awards, not the "teams" (guilty of that myself).

Unfortunately, there will always be dads that do all of the work. There just as easily can be those uninvolved dads that just hand the kit to the kid to build all on their own regardless of age/ability (reminds me of a recent Subaru commerical).
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psycaz
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Re: Excluding Tigers from competing for Pack Champion?

Post by psycaz »

If you need any info to help justify why TO include tigers, just print out anything related to PWD from Don Murphy. The whole intent of the project is for it to be a parent - boy project. The boy is NOT supposed to do it alone.
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Re: Excluding Tigers from competing for Pack Champion?

Post by mbb »

Wait. In fact, the tiger cub Dads are the least knowledgable usually, there is a learning curve. I say you prohibit Webelos because by then the Dads know too much!

Really, you are waaaaaayyyyy off base. It is a joint project, its NEVER a uniform competion, it goes to the TEAM that learns the most, and works the hardest, and has a bit of luck too, and sometimes spends the most money for tungsten and tools, Period.

There are plenty of Webelos whose dads build their whole car too!

Maybe we should quit giving out awards so the focus would be on the parent-son time spent, and recognize the parents too

There is a 250 kid pack near us that holds a one-day build it and race it derby. Dad and kid show up with tools, they give out kits at 9am, and start racing late afternoon. I LIKE that as an alternative concept in a large pack. They also have an unlimited race for those that want to spend more time in the usual way.
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Go Bubba Go
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Re: Excluding Tigers from competing for Pack Champion?

Post by Go Bubba Go »

gpraceman wrote:I'm with Stan on this.
Me too.

BTW I don't recall the last time we had a Tiger take our "Fastest of the Pack" award. The only ones that ever come close are those that have older brothers who did well, and did so recently.

From my observation even the teams that eventually become the most "Pineheaded" usually have to go through the Tiger year and do worse than they expected before they realize that there's more to this activity than they thought. Then the homework (emphasis on WORK) really begins.

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Re: Excluding Tigers from competing for Pack Champion?

Post by PWD_addict »

That's madness. Sounds like sour grapes to me. Someone got some bad crack that night. :cry:
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Re: Excluding Tigers from competing for Pack Champion?

Post by bad_karma_2805a1 »

Once again Mr. Pope has hit the nail right on the head. The Tigers have just as much right as the rest of the Pack to be in the finals. Man some people just don't get it.
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Re: Excluding Tigers from competing for Pack Champion?

Post by ScoutAndDadTeam »

I have to agree with the other people on this topic. Tigers should be included. What first grader wouldn't love to get a trophy.

Getting away from PWD for a moment....What rank sells the most popcorn? What rank is the most excited about scouts? What rank does the most boy to boy recruiting? What rank is your pack's future? The only time to exclude ranks in an activity should be for safety reasons (follow the guide to safe scouting). It doesn't say that Tigers should be excluded from being eligible to be the pack champions. Always keep in mind fun with a purpose. The purpose of PWD is well defined. It is the job of the leaders to make PWD fun for everyone.
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Re: Excluding Tigers from competing for Pack Champion?

Post by dna1990 »

I will redundantly agree.

Tigers ranks are very important to watch in terms of the health of your pack. Don't do something to alienate them, especially at mid year (usual time for PWD) and closing in on new Scout Rally Night, where you want Tigers to be salesmen to K graders.

The issue is Dad Builders, as already pointed out. The possibility exists for too-few-little-fingerprints at all ranks.
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