Pro-Wheel Shaver XT

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NJDerbyDad
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Pro-Wheel Shaver XT

Post by NJDerbyDad » Sat Feb 18, 2006 11:07 pm

I'm practicing with the Pro-Wheel Shaver XT on some wheels before using it on the ones we plan to use. I seem to be having a lot of trouble with blade adjustment. At some point, the "larger" wheel cannot slide on and off the Pro-Hub tool, and I have to loosen the screw and rock it a bit to get the wheel on and off. The problem is that after adjusting the blade, and tightening the screw for the Pro-Hub tool again, I get one of two results:

1. I'm not removing any more material than before

2. It's to tight that I can't turn the wheel at all

Does it just take more practice, or am I missing something?



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Re: Pro-Wheel Shaver XT

Post by gtobob » Sun Feb 19, 2006 9:00 am

I have had the same problem. I begin shaving by having the blade just barely touching the wheel, shaving off only the side edges. I turn the blade up by the tiniest of increments, only 1/64 of a revolution (I guess). At one point all is shaving smoothly and then "JAM!" the wheel just gets stuck! It digs in a cross tread groove and I have to back off the blade two whole turns and start over. Of course it's much harder now because it has that groove in it.
I think I read that putting graphite on the wheel while shaving it helps.
Any ideas?



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Re: Pro-Wheel Shaver XT

Post by gpraceman » Sun Feb 19, 2006 9:32 am

gtobob wrote:At one point all is shaving smoothly and then "JAM!" the wheel just gets stuck! It digs in a cross tread groove and I have to back off the blade two whole turns and start over. Of course it's much harder now because it has that groove in it.
I experienced the same thing. I gave up on the tool since it was hard enough for me to use, much less my two boys. If it is not something that they can use, then I am not going to bother with it.


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NJDerbyDad
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Re: Pro-Wheel Shaver XT

Post by NJDerbyDad » Sun Feb 19, 2006 9:36 am

One thing I've noticed is that there is "slop" in the connection between the blade and the threaded rod used for adjustment. When you reverse direction of adjustment it takes one or two revolutions of the rod before the blade starts to move. You can see this by leaving the locking screw tight, and see how much back out the rod before hitting any resistance. There also seems to be slop between the rod and knob. This makes it very difficult (for me) to back out the blade slightly when it starts to "dig in" too much.

There appears to be 24 threads per inch on the threaded rod, meaning that one revolution of the rod results in a blade adjustment of 1/24", or 0.0417". To get a blade adjustment of 0.001 inches you would have to turn the rod approximately 1/42 of a revolution, or 8.64 degrees. Not that hard without all the slop, but much harder with it.

I found that if I back out the retaining screw for the Pro-Hub tool I can get past the groove in the wheel, but what this is really doing is letting the Pro-Hub tool rotate away from the blade, causing the edge of the blade to no longer be parallel to the tool, thus shaving the tread at an angle. Eventually, after tightening the screw in increments, and shaving in between, I get back to shaving "square", but I think there must be a better way.



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Re: Pro-Wheel Shaver XT

Post by Teeeman » Sun Feb 19, 2006 1:06 pm

I've trued up the cutting edges by hand (2-1/2 hours) and had tried to shim the tool and still can't get past shaving tapers (where the wheel free-rolls in one direction)... the blade rocks, and the head rocks... I had 1 more thing to try today, but I am starting to think a major tool redesign would be needed to really have an effective and repeatable product from this device.

-Terry


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Re: Pro-Wheel Shaver XT

Post by doct1010 » Sun Feb 19, 2006 2:05 pm

gtobob wrote:I have had the same problem. I begin shaving by having the blade just barely touching the wheel, shaving off only the side edges. I turn the blade up by the tiniest of increments, only 1/64 of a revolution (I guess). At one point all is shaving smoothly and then "JAM!" the wheel just gets stuck! It digs in a cross tread groove and I have to back off the blade two whole turns and start over. Of course it's much harder now because it has that groove in it.
I think I read that putting graphite on the wheel while shaving it helps.
Any ideas?
This may sound too obvious, but are you starting with the blade adjusted to highest spot on wheel? Then from that point forward turning it down in increments? I agree this isn't the easiest tool to operate, especially for small or weak hands. Never had a wheel just "get stuck", hard turning yes.



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Re: Pro-Wheel Shaver XT

Post by RACER X » Sun Feb 19, 2006 10:38 pm

Guys, Guys, Guys,

Now 1st. you can always e-mail me from the Derby Worx site to get help with your tools or concerns. 2nd. you would of seen the site adderess if you were reading the directions :lol: :lol: :lol: just having fun!!!

There are several things basic things to do here and a few that I will outline as well that we have found helpful in the last few months.

The outter dimension and the slots of the blade are laser cut and we made several thousand late last summer, the next batch of them will have the drive slot narrower which will take the extra turn of the feed screw out, but this in no way effects the function of the tool. The head of the feed screw is also machined on both the top and bottom for accuracy when pushing and pulling the blade. If you need to back it up, you can feel the point of engagement, slightly retract the blade, then return it back in to hold the blade.

The cross bolt that passes through the blade and holds the cover and upper bracket on also provides tension on the blade and helps hold it in position. Use the following procedure to correctly adjust it and do not try to tighten, shim, align or hold with it, it works well when adjusted properly.
#1 Tighten up the bolt with the provided allen wrench until it pulls down the square nut, tighten snugly.
#2 Back the bolt off aprox. 1/3 of a turn.
#3 Place the tool on a hard surface with the head of the allen bolt facing up and firmly strike it with a hammer to seat the bolt. The blade should move smoothly but firmly and the top adjuster portion of the tool should not be loose, this is the correct setting to leave the tool in.

The next important issue I would like to cover is blade direction. I have had several customers disassemble thier tool and put the blade in backwards. There is a tappered edge on the blade, this is cosmetic, the rear square edge is the cutting edge. The rear edge is the lowest point of the blade and it has a 5 deg. back angle on it, so it you have re-dressed the edge, it is not to be flat.

When setting up your Pro Wheel Shaver XT on your Pro Hub Tool, place a wheel on the shaft and set the wheel shaver so the cross bolt in the blade is in the center of the tread on the wheel, this will help equalize the blade while cutting. From here start with step 1 and find the high spot on ALL of the wheels, set the blade to slightly shave the highest point on the wheel with the most radial runout. Rotate the wheel to a low point to remove, install the next at the low point and shave. Work through all 4, then start over with a slight adjustment of more blade. There is no reason that this should be very hard to turn unless you are not finding the highest point to start with. Your shavings should be light and you should be able to work through the set of 4 on 3-4 blade settings in 10 to 15 min. once you get the wheels round, you can loosen the cross bolt that holds the shaver to the hub tool, rock it back, careful not to loose your position, then remove and replace your wheel. It you use a slight up-ward pressure and shave untill all of the light fluffy shavings are gone, you should have all 4 of your wheels with in .001" of each other, and believe me, if it wouldn't, Max-V would not sell it. I can personally do a set of wheels in under 15 min, every time that are consistantly with in .001" of each other.

Here is a little tip that I have been using: #1, Make sure the pins on your Pro Hub Tool are straight and true, they are only .095" to fit the hub bore, so if not careful, they can be bent, ever so slightly will effect the performance of the shaver.#2, polish the pin on your Pro hub tool with 600-800-1000 sand paper for a better finish. Next, apply 2 drops of Nye oil to the shaft before installing the wheel, this makes it even easier to rotate and burnishes the bore. We clean it up with a pipe cleaner and de-narured alcohol then soap and water before assembly with graphite. The straight lines in the tread face can be left for directional stability or they also easly polish out.

I know this is long, but I hope it helps. We do have 1000's of satisified owners of this tool and we want you to be one too.

Also we have a short video that is helpful under the video button at www.Derbyworx.com



Race Fast

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I would like to thank my sponsors: Dremel Tool, House of Kolor paints, Craftsman Tools, Derby Worx Pro Tools & Derby Worx Pro Wheels, Micro Finish & sand paper and 3M tape.

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Re: Pro-Wheel Shaver XT

Post by NJDerbyDad » Sun Feb 19, 2006 11:05 pm

I understand your recommendations and plan to try them tomorrow. To clarify my problem though, the problem appears after several passes, usually when the "largest" wheel is being shaved on the entire circumference, and the smaller wheels are being shaved at high spots only.

Also, it makes sense to me to only do two wheels at a time. While the left and right wheels should be the same size, I don't see any advantage to having the front wheels the same size as the back wheels.



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Re: Pro-Wheel Shaver XT

Post by RACER X » Mon Feb 20, 2006 10:17 am

NJDerbyDad wrote:I understand your recommendations and plan to try them tomorrow. To clarify my problem though, the problem appears after several passes, usually when the "largest" wheel is being shaved on the entire circumference, and the smaller wheels are being shaved at high spots only.
Yes, this is correct because the blade is in the higher setting, add a little more blade depth to the large wheel, shave it, then move to the smaller wheels, repeat until all wheels are the same size.
NJDerbyDad wrote: Also, it makes sense to me to only do two wheels at a time. While the left and right wheels should be the same size, I don't see any advantage to having the front wheels the same size as the back wheels.
If the left and right wheels are of different size the car will pull towards the smaller wheel, unless you have radicaly aligned your car. If you must, put matching sizes on the rear and matching sizes on the front (which really will not matter with a 3 wheeler). This is why we recomend testing for high spots and working wiht a set of 4.

Race Fast

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I would like to thank my sponsors: Dremel Tool, House of Kolor paints, Craftsman Tools, Derby Worx Pro Tools & Derby Worx Pro Wheels, Micro Finish & sand paper and 3M tape.

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Re: Pro-Wheel Shaver XT

Post by Stephen's Dad » Mon Feb 20, 2006 6:26 pm

We've only used Stephen's Pro Wheel Shaver XT on a few practice wheels so far so this probably isn't worth much. The only time we've experienced any lockup is when he turned the blade too far down between cuts. Oh...and the time we were turning the wheel in the wrong direction. Is everyone rotating the wheel in the correct direction?

Would there be any advantage to using a cutting lubricant or would the wheel become too slick to turn? Maybe graphite?


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Re: Pro-Wheel Shaver XT

Post by NJDerbyDad » Mon Feb 20, 2006 9:38 pm

I'm definately turning the wheel in the right direction - counterclockwise as viewed from the spoke side of the wheel. I agree that the problem would appear to be that I'm adjusting the blade too much at some point, but without any way to measure the adjustment I'm making it's hard to know until the wheel gets stuck... and then it's too late.

But this is why I'm practicing on wheels we don't intend to use. Of course, if I get this thing figured out, I can always use the wheels if I decide to later.



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Re: Pro-Wheel Shaver XT

Post by RACER X » Mon Feb 20, 2006 9:49 pm

Start with the highest spot on the wheel with the most runout, bump it with the blade and lightly shave it. Work through all 4, than back to #1, on the high spot and add a small amount of knob, 1/10 to 1/8th of a turn. If you re-adjust the blad on the high spot, you cannot over do it.

YOU CAN DO IT AND WILL GET BETTER WITH PRACTICE.

Believe me , we won a lot of races and districts on a lathe and mill, once we created the tools for the public, we now race on the tools and not the lathe. We still win, even a bit faster and have set the district track record on Pro Wheel Shaver XT'ed wheels.

Race Fast

Racer X


Driver of #9 "The Shooting Star"

I would like to thank my sponsors: Dremel Tool, House of Kolor paints, Craftsman Tools, Derby Worx Pro Tools & Derby Worx Pro Wheels, Micro Finish & sand paper and 3M tape.

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Re: Pro-Wheel Shaver XT

Post by Teeeman » Mon Feb 20, 2006 9:58 pm

RACER X wrote:Start with the highest spot on the wheel with the most runout, bump it with the blade and lightly shave it. Work through all 4, than back to #1, on the high spot and add a small amount of knob, 1/10 to 1/8th of a turn. If you re-adjust the blad on the high spot, you cannot over do it.

YOU CAN DO IT AND WILL GET BETTER WITH PRACTICE.
How do we keep the blade parallel to the wheel?
My blade shifts in the track when withdrawn, and then straightens up on insertion...

and the whole head assembly still wobbles... I'm experimenting with shims right now...

but I have yet to make 2 wheels in a row that free-roll straight...

have you modified your shaver in ANY way?

-Terry


"I dunno..." - Uncle Eddie, Christmas Vacation

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Re: Pro-Wheel Shaver XT

Post by NJDerbyDad » Mon Feb 20, 2006 10:01 pm

RACER X wrote:If the left and right wheels are of different size the car will pull towards the smaller wheel, unless you have radicaly aligned your car. If you must, put matching sizes on the rear and matching sizes on the front (which really will not matter with a 3 wheeler). This is why we recomend testing for high spots and working wiht a set of 4.
I understand that the car will pull toward the smaller wheel. That's why I believe it's important to have a matched set (size wise) in the rear, and another matched set in the front. I still see no benefit in having the front match the rear. Am I missing something?
RACER X wrote:2nd. you would of seen the site adderess if you were reading the directions :lol: :lol: :lol: just having fun!!!
Believe me, I'm well aware of your site - having viewed the tool videos many times before purchasing - and I did read the instructions. However, my experience with support in general is that I can get much more bang for the buck by raising the subject in a public forum, where I can get many responses from many points of view, all from a single post.

Plus, by me asking - and you responding - here, you can lessen the number of times you end up answering the same question on your own site.



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Re: Pro-Wheel Shaver XT

Post by Wingman » Tue Feb 21, 2006 5:27 am

There might be some variation in effective cut angle caused by where and how strongly the wheel is gripped as its turned. Since the outer surface of the tread is connected to the sidewall while the inside is not connected to anything, gripping the wheel low toward the unsupported, inside edge is going to cause it to bulge out more than the outside. The net result would be a sloped cut, even though the blade is staight to the tread when its not being gripped. If this is the case, try gripping the wheel consistently near the outside edge.



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